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  1. #1
    artiomvr is offline Novice
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    Need some help on a project

    Hello guys,

    First of all let me tell you i'm new here and came to get some info and to learn more about access and hope some kind people of the community could answer some of my questions

    The thing is that I've got an test on access / Excel course in 1 month and we have to make our own little project but at the same time i had this guy that's working for a fence placing company that asked me if it's possible to make some kind of calculator that could estimate the price needed for the fences when he just inputs the "Length" and "Height" needed.

    So i thought to myself why not make my project exactly on this and help this guy make his job easier at the same time, let me explain exactly what info i got and what he needs

    Info i got:

    1. I can make my own reference for different type of fences
    2. I've got around 300 types of different fences
    3. I've got the fence Length / Height and Price per Unit
    4. There are gates too but that's for later use & he can calculate it by head since it's usually 1-3 gates that are needed

    What i need:

    1. When he inputs on a calculator that he needs lets say 350 meters of length and 10 meters of height then he gets the answer on which fences he needs and how many fences are needed to get to 350 meters length and 10 meters height and how much this would cost in total
    2. When he inputs the "fences reference" and the meters needed he gets the total price (because there are different type of fences so he could choose the fence needed by himself so the computer could calculate if this fence = 1.5 meters and he needs 350 meters this would need "x" amount of fences and this would be "x" amount total price)


    So I'm still thinking on how to go around this... but the thing is that with all the things I've done so far or tried out i'm getting fail after fail and i wanted to have your thoughts on the way i could go around this

    Thanks for reading and hope you understand everything since English ain't my Mother tongue to start with but if you have any question just ask i'll reply as fast as i can.



    Oh and before i forget if you got any useful websites with guides or videos i could watch i'll take it thanks alot!!!

  2. #2
    CJ_London is online now VIP
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    suspect there is more data required - fence posts (and type my vary depending on type of fence)? labour to dig the hole? other materials such as concrete for posts, nails/screws, top/bottom of the fence trim?

    10m high is tall - not going on the Mexican border by any chance?

  3. #3
    orange's Avatar
    orange is offline Moderator
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    See the Database Planning and Design link in my signature for articles and tutorials on database. The tutorials from RogersAccessLibrary in the link are a great starting point.

    I see Ajax has replied ---I agree with his 10m height comment and also that any kind of construction involves materials(fencing, gates and posts that can vary considerably) and also time and effort. Materials alone, unless you're a DIY person, is rarely the cost of a "project".
    Good luck.

    Have you tried google with calculating cost of a fence as criteria? It may get you some info to help with your analysis.

  4. #4
    artiomvr is offline Novice
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    Wink

    Nice one about the Mexican wall made me giggle but no worries i live in Belgium which is kinda far from it hehe :P but the 10 meters was just an example because all the fences types varies on length/height

    and no worries about the labour or other materials his job is to answer clients that actually request the fences them self to place them at places such as aéroports and other companies so he just needs to tell them how many fences they need and how much it will cost them (that's actually what we talked about a few days ago but just to be sure i will call him back and ask for more details)

    Orange thanks for the Database planning link I will read / follow it right now

    I know that it seems simplistic the way I've explained it before, but actually that's really all he needs. My big problem at the moment is that with my knowledge i can't find a solution to add this blank field where he can input the numbers of meters needed so that the computer could calculate on the referenced fence.

    I've just made a quick example with modal dialog on how simplistic it should be and made a screen shot for you guys to understand better
    Click image for larger version. 

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    And a big thanks to both of you for the quick reply!!!

  5. #5
    Micron is offline Virtually Inert Person
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    I think your details are somewhat sketchy for getting any focused answers. Nothing on what the problem is, just that you've experienced failure. Personally I think you should pick something easier for your assignment. Then when you see how you do with whatever that is, apply what you learn to this fencing project. Construction cost estimators can be among the most involved and difficult db projects there is.
    The more we hear silence, the more we begin to think about our value in this universe.
    Paraphrase of Professor Brian Cox.

  6. #6
    artiomvr is offline Novice
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    i get what you mean Micron.. but once again the thing is it's not about construction but just about selling the fences and telling people instantly how many fences they will need for a certain length / height

    The problem i got is that i cannot find how to make a field for the end user to input data for the calculation let's say when he inputs than he needs 350 meters of length i don't really want those 350 meters to be stored i just want them to serve the only purpose of the calculation.

    Damn having some hard time to find my words here guys

  7. #7
    orange's Avatar
    orange is offline Moderator
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    You could have function that inputs values from a form. That function could return a value (amount of fence needed) and display it on the form.
    If you consider a fence to be made up of panels where 1 panel is x meters long and y meters high. Then the number of panels required can be calculated knowing the required total length and the required height. For simplicity, assume that all fences must use this panel design. If you need more panel types (different length, width, cost etc) then deal with that after you have solved the "1 panel only" fence calculator.
    Also, panels are available in integer amounts only--that is you can't have .35 panels or 2.6 panels.
    Good luck.

  8. #8
    Micron is offline Virtually Inert Person
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    Maybe part of what threw me is that if we're talking fences here, and something is 350 meters long, that's one (1) 350 meter long fence. To say how many fences you need to achieve that length is confusing. Perhaps the question is, how many 'panels' or how many 'sections' are needed to go 350 meters. In that case, since you have your fence types in a table, I presume those records include the length of a section, which is a value that should be in a control on your form. You can make this control invisible if you want, but it could be useful to see it. Then if 'length' is the total length required by the customer you need to divide 350 by the section length value. If the section is 2 meters in length, it calculates to 175 sections.

    To get the initial section values into the form, you should have an unbound combo that provides a list of the fence styles and filters the form based on a selection, which then shows the characteristics such as section length, price per section, etc. in the other form controls. Then you can do the calculations in any number of form controls that you desire by using the values contained in the form. If the combo is cleared, the calculations should be cleared as well.

    Not sure if I'm helping with any of that.

  9. #9
    orange's Avatar
    orange is offline Moderator
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    A simple calculator with no gates, no labour, no partial panels. Only 1 type of panel (as a starting point).

    Consider panels 3m (L) X 2m (H).

    A 3m long by 2m high fence requires 1 panel
    A 4m long by 3m high fence would require 4 panels (same as a 6m X 4m)
    A 17m long by 2m high would require 6 panels

  10. #10
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    Hi

    What we need is details about the Fence's. If the Fence is 6 Feet in Length and the user inputs 350 Mtrs then the calculation would display Fences Needed = 58.33

  11. #11
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    Do I get it correct, that fences are build from elements/modules/whatever, not from various raw materials?

    When yes, then you need:
    A table tblFenceTypes: FenceTypeID, FenceType; (Types differ by design, materials, ..., but not by width or heigth! Types include also e.g. gates of various design. You can have fence posts as separate types, or you include a post to every fence module element - but there will be problem with gates in this case, as gates usually have their own posts, which leaves one element adjacent to gate with unused post.)
    A table tblFenceElements: FenceElementID, FenceTypeID, FenceElement, Height, Width, ElementPrice; InstallingCost; (Furniture price is not included into element price!)
    A table tblFurniture: FurnitureID, Furniture, Unit, Price; (Screws, hinges, locks, concrete, ... - whatever is needed to assemble the fence element into fence)
    A table tblElementFurniture: ElementFurnitureID; FenceElementID, FurnitureID, QtyPerElement;
    A table tblAssembleOrder: AssembleOrderID, Client, Object, OrderDate, FinishedDate, OrderStatus, ...
    A table tblAssembleSide: AssembleSideID, AssembleOrderID, SideLength; (E.g. you have an order to assemble a fence with sides 2*100 m. and 2*75 m., so you have 4 sides with total length 350 m.)
    A table tblSideElements: SideElementsID, AssemblSideID, FenceElementID, Qty; (Entering quantities for side into calculation form is where form must calculate total length of all side elements, and correct user whenever it will exceed side length. And here will be your main problem also. Let's assume you have 75 m. side and it contains only 2 m. wide fence elements. 75 doesn't divide with 2! So you need some special elements to correct such situation.);
    And probably you need a table where your form on command stores quantities of all fence elements used for order, monetary amounts for all elements, monetary amount for furniture used for all elements, and total installing cost for all elements. And a table where all those amounts for order are totaled, plus VAT etc. is calculated.

  12. #12
    artiomvr is offline Novice
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    Guy's first of all i want to THANK all of you for the big help you've provided so far I've got like 50 times better in access in those past 2 days (and i went to the course since like a month for access -.-) so far I've been watching videos and reading all the information i could get so far and those provided by you.

    So now let's get back to the topic i sorry for throwing some people off but that's exactly what i meant there are different panels that got fixed sizes, and when a client comes in he request the price for the length and height needed by him. So since i can choose which panels he will take I need a form to calculate how many panels/posts are needed for his measurement. Once i know how many panels are needed i can calculate the price of those panels with VAT and make an Invoice Form.

    I've seen several times in the topic that people wanted more details about the fences i can post the Fence Website here the problem is that I don't know if i'm allowed to do so, but tell me if i can and i will post it. The website is in French but it's well built and easy to understand even for some one who doesn't understand French you got all fences and gates sorted out by Mark and if you click on it you can download a PDF file for every fence which tells your height / length per panel that the panels are available in and the after how many meters there is a post (for some fences) I've made some huge improvement so far.

    But I've noticed that some type of fences could get the same height but with different Mesh size and some panels got different posts that depends if it's placed on platinum or not that's where i'm blocked right now to put it simple i'll add 3 screen shots .

    Click image for larger version. 

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    As you can see in here for this kind of panel it's pretty easy since you know the height the price per meter and the post length (after how many meters there should be a post)


    Click image for larger version. 

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    While in this picture I've noticed there were the same sizes but with a wider Mesh so that's one of my problems at the moment


    Click image for larger version. 

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    And that's the last example that I've told you about the post size differs so i'm wondering how i should go around it.


    Once again thank you guys for your time and sorry for my sketchy English

  13. #13
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    Hi

    I was under the impression that you were working with Fence Panels as shown in the attachment.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Fence Panel.jpg  

  14. #14
    artiomvr is offline Novice
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    Well there are the fences that got panels and those that do not like linked above

    I consider those as panels
    Click image for larger version. 

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    and those too but as you can see there are 3 panels 1 on another in height
    Click image for larger version. 

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  15. #15
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    Hi

    Yes Very true and to enable us to create a Formula we need a couple of tables as follows:-

    tblPanelType
    -PanelTypeID - Autonumber - Primary Key
    -PanelType - Text

    In this table you would list all of the various Panel Types as shown in the attached.

    You would then have a related table which contains the dimensions of the Panel Selected.

    Each Panel Type can have any number of different sizes and Costs.

    We need to know this information before we can offer any further help.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails PanelTypes.PNG  

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