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  1. #1
    freshfish is offline Novice
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    Question Computational thinking demonstrated in Access?

    Hello,


    I have been learning everything I can about DBs because I'm teaching a course that requires students to create a product to solve a real world problem. Most students have always chosen Java, but one option is databases and so I now have kids doing database projects using Access. The problem is that the rubric is pretty vague and geared more towards coding projects. The biggest issue I am running into is the "Low to High Complexity" and "Low to High Ingenuity"
    Complexity = their demonstration of their computational thinking
    Ingenuity = their creativity in facilitating the user's life

    So I have the following requirements:
    1) At least 2-3 related tables
    2) Normalization
    3) Forms for user to add/delete
    4) At least 3 Queries to pull meaningful data (using OR AND and operators)
    5) At least 3 Reports
    6) Validation rules and input masks
    7) Password protected and a "switchboard" to create an interface

    At this point I dont know how else I can have students demonstrate computational thinking or ingenuity apart from what I have. Not sure where they can plug in conditional statements or how they could use VB simply to add functionality
    Any guidance on my list and the question would be greatly appreciated because I am very new to database development.
    Thank you so much in advance
    Omar

  2. #2
    Micron is offline Virtually Inert Person
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    Out of curiosity, given the scope of learning, how long is the course? At least 3 months I hope - unless the focus isn't on doing it all correctly. Maybe less if you forget the vb part. I guess it depends on what examples fit either realm of measurement, but when I read it, it seems like you have it backwards. Don't creativity and complexity go hand in hand?
    The more we hear silence, the more we begin to think about our value in this universe.
    Paraphrase of Professor Brian Cox.

  3. #3
    freshfish is offline Novice
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    Well its essentially the IB program and in Computer Science they have their project with a rubric set by the IBO. And the main criterion has been made pretty ambiguous, to as they say, allow for flexibility in student solutions...but most projects are the classic Java projects and its fairly well documented as to what is expected of kids for Java apps...but for those that chose Access (usually because they are intimidated by coding) have much less to go on as the IB does not provide specifics. But here is the standard for scoring 9-12 points (12 being the max)
    Code:
    The use of techniques demonstrates a high level of complexity and ingenuity in addressing the scenario identified in criterion A. It is characterized by the appropriate use of existing tools. The techniques are adequate for the task and their use is explained. All sources are identified.
    They have about 3 months to work on the project independently with a little support from myself but am limited by how much I can do as its not part of the curriculum. I just want to best guide them and am at a loss

  4. #4
    June7's Avatar
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    What age group - high school?

    Is the password protection to restrict the developer access or to validate users where users create their own unique password? A username/password process is certainly one place where conditional statements can be utilized. Code (macro or VBA) can be used to open/close forms/reports

    Advise to avoid the following:

    1. lookups in tables

    2. formatting in tables

    3. multi-value fields

    4. spaces and punctuation/special characters (underscore only exception) in naming convention as well as reserved words as names

    5. the old 'switchboard' wizard, if you know where to find it


    I will offer one idea for a database some of the students might relate to. I developed a db to keep track of umpire game assignments and their compensation. Had 4 tables, 3 forms, 2 queries, 1 report to meet my needs. Could have more queries and reports.

    There are certainly a lot of sites on web that can offer guidance. Recommend:
    http://allenbrowne.com/tips.html
    https://www.w3schools.com/sql/
    How to attach file: http://www.accessforums.net/showthread.php?t=70301 To provide db: copy, remove confidential data, run compact & repair, zip w/Windows Compression.

  5. #5
    freshfish is offline Novice
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    Yes, they are 11th graders.
    Thank you for the list of things to avoid, thats a good list to have. Access is so daunting for newbies
    The umpire db is actually right up their alley (although most of them dont really know much about baseball :O)
    Not sure how you feel about this, but would you mind sharing the db with me so I can show them a completed/clean db? I can add dummy data as I'm sure you would want to delete the data. I have created 2 dummy ones but not sure how "legit" they are

  6. #6
    June7's Avatar
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    Happy to provide the db. Keep in mind this was strictly for my own use and very minimal design. The VBA code included has nothing to do with original purpose of db. I now use this db for testing and analyzing forum questions. I left some code I thought students might find interesting. Also 2 oddball queries just because they are cool.

    The db demonstrates a less than fully normalized structure (see the Games table) and how such a structure can be dealt with to achieve desired results. I adhere to the precept 'Normalize until it hurts and denormalize until it works'. The desired result was to generate the 1 report that summarizes umpire compensation.

    I forgot to remove lookup settings on 2 fields in Games table. For reasons to not use lookups with alias in table, review http://access.mvps.org/Access/lookupfields.htm. Build comboboxes on form. These settings in table can assist with building the combobox on form but since I find it is seldom necessary to have the same table/fields on more than one form for data entry/edit, this advantage is outweighed by aggravation from lookups in table. When I view tables I want to see actual data, not alias. Users should interact with forms and reports, not tables and queries.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    How to attach file: http://www.accessforums.net/showthread.php?t=70301 To provide db: copy, remove confidential data, run compact & repair, zip w/Windows Compression.

  7. #7
    Perceptus's Avatar
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    This would have been fun when I was in high school. Lucky kids

  8. #8
    Micron is offline Virtually Inert Person
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    The following comments are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of this station.

    For the ingenuity part, being able to understand normalization and entity/relationship concepts would definitely be a factor because you have to be able to apply the theory to achieve a well designed table structure. This takes rote or memorization out of the equation which is where I'd primarily place code. When it comes to the interface, the creation of database elements that works with that design plan would be part of the equation. If they had to provide a rough outline of what it will do and how it will support a need and then from the initial creation of tables to the final interface, create and develop accordingly, it might indicate a measure of ingenuity.

    To me, coding would be more around complexity. While it may be easier to learn vba than other codes, the vba object model along with all of the methods and properties of that model, is quite complex. So much so that much of the coding can be replaced (to a degree) with macros, which is like cherry picking your objects and the actions to be associated with them. Code eventually becomes more about remembering the properties and methods of an object, the hierarchy of those objects, and the syntax around all of that. Thus memorization of complex object oriented programming versus ingenuity of applied normalization.

    I assumed that being a teacher you were right up to speed with database design concepts. Not sure how much time you want to spend boning up on stuff if it's not your forte, but here are the links I usually provide for novices, some of which you've already been warned about. Those links will provide some of the reason behind the advice. Take from them what you will.

    Normalization is paramount. Diagramming maybe not so much for some people.

    Normalization Parts I, II, III, IV, and V
    http://rogersaccessblog.blogspot.com...ng-part-i.html
    and/or
    http://holowczak.com/database-normalization/

    Entity-Relationship Diagramming: Part I, II, III and IV
    http://rogersaccessblog.blogspot.ca/...ng-part-i.html

    How do I Create an Application in Microsoft Access?
    http://rogersaccessblog.blogspot.ca/...cation-in.html

    Important for success:
    One source about how to name things - http://access.mvps.org/access/general/gen0012.htm
    What not to use in names - http://allenbrowne.com/AppIssueBadWord.html
    About Auto Numbers
    - http://www.utteraccess.com/wiki/Autonumbers
    - http://access.mvps.org/access/general/gen0025.htm

    The evils of lookup fields - http://access.mvps.org/access/lookupfields.htm
    Table and PK design tips - http://www.fmsinc.com/free/newtips/primarykey.asp
    About calculated table fields - http://allenbrowne.com/casu-14.html

  9. #9
    freshfish is offline Novice
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    Quote Originally Posted by June7 View Post
    Happy to provide the db. Keep in mind this was strictly for my own use and very minimal design..
    Thank you so much..great learning tool for both the kids and myself I really appreciate all the effort you are putting in

  10. #10
    freshfish is offline Novice
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    Quote Originally Posted by Micron View Post
    right up to speed with database design concepts.
    Thanks for all the advice. Unfortunately although I am somewhat up to speed, more from a theoretical standpoint, the rubric is so vague and does not differentiate between projects made using Java, or those coded in PHP and use MySQL, or DB projects using Access, etc...
    As part of the process (they follow the SDLC cycle) they do have to design the product first. So they do need to plan out their tables, queries, etc ahead of time.
    Again, thanks for all the input everyone, it has been very helpful!!

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